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Scoop on Joey Gaithright?

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Postby Surfs up » Sat Jan 07, 2006 3:57 pm

He takes to many right hand turns when he gets to first base. Can't steal first. Maybe if he develops some power to hit balls out of a little park he will be worth having.A one dementional player IF he gets on base.
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Re: ...

Postby raiders_umpire » Sat Jan 07, 2006 5:13 pm

riverrat wrote:Its not just about 'steals'. Its about having a lead-off man with speed at the top.





It is all about the steals with Gathright. Once he shows me that he wants to play professional baseball by trying to get better instead of jumping over cars, then I might warm up to him. But I have seen him too many times now play and show me no hustle, heart, or desire for the game of baseball.
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Postby Pogotheostrich » Sat Jan 07, 2006 5:26 pm

riverrat wrote:There was a question asked here or on sports talk radio. Whats more difficult to find? A good closer or a good lead-off man?
A good leadoff man but Gathright isn't a good leadoff man, he is just a very fast one.
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Re: ...

Postby AmishRakeFight2005 » Sat Jan 07, 2006 10:16 pm

raiders_umpire wrote:no hustle, heart, or desire for the game of baseball.


I disagree with you completely. After working with the Durham Bulls for three seasons, Joey Gathright (and Matt Diaz) is one of the hardest working guys in baseball. I guess its easy to make judgement calls about people while you lie on your couch eating nachos.

Your remarks could be better suited for a guy like Manny Ramirez.
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Postby bronxxbomber » Sun Jan 08, 2006 12:39 am

AmishRakeFight2005 wrote:
raiders_umpire wrote:no hustle, heart, or desire for the game of baseball.


I disagree with you completely. After working with the Durham Bulls for three seasons, Joey Gathright (and Matt Diaz) is one of the hardest working guys in baseball. I guess its easy to make judgement calls about people while you lie on your couch eating nachos.

Your remarks could be better suited for a guy like Manny Ramirez.
Not cool :-t .
Anyway, hardwork doesn't always translate into anything because I'm sure every player not in the majors is hustling to get there because that's where the money's at. I think the other guys are arguing that Gathright needs to improve his eye so that he can utilize that speed more.
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Postby Ender » Sun Jan 08, 2006 1:20 am

riverrat wrote:Its not just about 'steals'. Its about having a lead-off man with speed at the top. Steals, taking the extra base, putting pressure on the defense. Look at what Pods did with the WSox. Its why the
C(h)ubs traded for Pierre. Small ball.
There was a question asked here or on sports talk radio. Whats more difficult to find? A good closer or a good lead-off man?


Pods didn't do anything for the white sox, they were below average when it comes to sacrifice attempts and the team didn't score anymore runs than the previous year.

In 2005 they scored 741 runs vs 645 allowed
In 2004 they scored 865 runs vs 831 allowed

I'll do the math for you, it was 100% pitching and 0% pods who didn't outproduce Lee on the year.

Pods had a .351 OBP which is decent for a leadoff hitter, he had a .700 OPS which is anemic for any hitter, he had a .72% success rate stealing, conventional logic says that 1 CS offsets 2 SB which means he had 13 net SB's, which isn't terrible but its certainly not great. I find it incredibly hard to believe that he had much to do with the team making the world series.

They made it because of good SP and a great bullpen.
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Re: ...

Postby AmishRakeFight2005 » Sun Jan 08, 2006 10:07 am

bronxxbomber wrote:
AmishRakeFight2005 wrote:
raiders_umpire wrote:no hustle, heart, or desire for the game of baseball.


I disagree with you completely. After working with the Durham Bulls for three seasons, Joey Gathright (and Matt Diaz) is one of the hardest working guys in baseball.I guess its easy to make judgement calls about people while you lie on your couch eating nachos.

Your remarks could be better suited for a guy like Manny Ramirez.

I think the other guys are arguing that Gathright needs to improve his eye so that he can utilize that speed more.


I'd agree with you there but don't say the guy has no "heart or desire" big difference.
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Postby SHOCKandAWE » Sun Jan 08, 2006 12:45 pm

No..I think his exact words where no hustle, heart, or desire for the game of baseball.

I doubt anyone can come to this conclusion unless they go to practice everyday with the guy, go to every game, and maybe even stay in the same household.

I agree that it is very easy to make this statement sitting in the seats! ``
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Postby AcidRock23 » Sun Jan 08, 2006 1:01 pm

Looking at his #s, it looks like he might benefit from a bit more time in the minors, rather than being plugged into a leadoff slot. He had .400 OBP in AA in 03 so there may be something there worth working on. I don't follow TB hardly at all so I have no idea if he sits around eating nachos and/ or jumping over cars.

At 24, I don't see him quite having what it takes to lead off in the majors. It's got to be rather dismal playing for TB as well. Still, not totally worthless to keep an eye on him, if only b/c looking is free. Baseball Forecaster gives him a HIGH upside potential of 50 SB (w/ only 13% reliability, suggesting who knows what he might do...) so that'd be worth keeping an eye on. Or stash him on your bench and wait for the guys who blew off speed at the draft to start waving guys around at anybody w/ a few SB and dangle him. There's always some guys in our league who miss their targeted speedsters and are going 'who wants to trade me some SB?'.
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Postby hot sauce » Sun Jan 08, 2006 8:57 pm

I think Gathright is an excellent fantasy target right now. He has not been traded yet and stands to be a 4th or 5th OF with Tampa Bay this year. But he will get traded. If its to a team like the Marlins, he could be an extremely valuable fantasy commodity. Once he does get traded (if he is scheduled for regular or semi-regular AB's) expect his value to shoot up. One or two category guys like him are not always a good way to go, but with regular ab's, his speed is capable of dominating the stolen base category, while contributing runs and a solid average.

The guy has absolutely no power (1 career HR, came this year at AAA), but blazing speed. He covers a ton of ground in the OF, but needs to work on his defense. He has shown good plate discipline in the minors, but he will get challenged more in the majors. Many people view him as a fourth OF, but with even 400 AB's he could make a nice fantasy impact.

He is still young and shouldn't yet be lumped in with all other failed speedsters. If he takes more walks (like he did in the minors) he could develop into an excellent lead off hitter. If he doesn't develop any more, I still like his chances to be at the very least a viable steals/runs fantasy option.

On the high end, he is something like Juan Pierre, maybe more steals. On the low end, he is another speed flameout. In the middle, he is a 4th OF (still has fantasy value). Without much improvement, I think he eventually turns out to be a better version of Alex Sanchez, with upside.
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