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Postby rmande09 » Fri Jun 30, 2006 5:02 pm

People vastly overrating Soriano and vastly underrating Teix. Hmm... Interesting.

On one hand, you have a guy who had an unreal first two months. He is putting up great numbers in a contract year, and has since fallen back down to earth and begun to slow down. There is no doubt he will finish with great numbers, but that's because of the padding he will have. He will be nothing more than Soriano-average over the next few months.

And then there is Teixeira, who is 26 and has ridiculous career averages despite this being only his fourth full Big League season. He's off to a slow start, but it's hard to ignore his 2004 and 2005 seasons at the ages of 24 and 25, respectively. If people want to overlook him and what-not, that's fine, but lets not talk about overrating a player.
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Postby Belle4Hall88 » Sun Jul 02, 2006 10:17 pm

Revised Rankings: Top 50 for 07

1. Albert Pujols, 1B, STL
2. Johan Santana, SP, MIN
3. Carl Crawford, OF, TB
4. David Wright, 3B, NYM
5. Alex Rodriguez, 3B, NYY
6. Jose Reyes, 2B, NYM
7. Carlos Beltran, OF, NYM
8. Travis Hafner, DH, CLE
9. Manny Ramirez, OF, BOS
10. Miguel Cabrera, 3B/OF, FLA
11. David Ortiz, 1B/DH, BOS
12. Fransisco Liriano, SP, MIN
13. Ichiro Suzuki, OF, SEA
14. Grady Sizemore, OF, CLE
15. Alfonso Soriano, OF, WAS
16. Jason Bay, OF, PIT
17. Vernon Wells, OF, TOR
18. Ryan Howard, 1B, PHI
19. Vladimir Guerrero, OF, ANA
20. Pedro Martinez, SP, NYM
21. Matt Holliday, OF, COL
22. Joe Mauer, C, MIN
23. Miguel Tejada, SS, BAL
24. Carlos Zambrano, SP, CHC
25. Scott Kazmir, SP, TB
26. Carlos Lee, OF, MIL
27. Chase Utley, 2B, PHI
28. Johanthon Papelbon, CL, BOS
29. Mark Teixeria, 1B, TEX
30. Derek Jeter, SS, NYY
31. Lance Berkman, OF, HOU
32. Chris Carpenter, SP, STL
33. Roy Halladay, SP, TOR
34. Brandon Webb, SP, ARZ
35. B.J. Ryan, CL, TOR
36. Derek Lee, 1B, CHC
37. Michael Young, SS, TEX
38. Jake Peavy, SP, SD
39. Jason Schmidt, SP, SF
40. Curt Schilling, SP, BOS
41. Bobby Jenks, CL, CWS
42. Paul Konerko, 1B, CWS
43. Jim Thome, 1B, CWS
44. Justin Morneau, 1B, MIN
45. Andruw Jones, OF, ATL
46. Chris Young, SP, SD
47. Chris Capuano, SP, MIL
48. Scott Rolen, 3B, STL
49. Todd Helton, 1B, COL
50. Corey Patterson, OF, BAL
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Postby Belle4Hall88 » Sun Jul 02, 2006 11:49 pm

bump
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Postby Scout » Mon Jul 03, 2006 12:16 am

Belle4Hall88, did you make these rankings? A few comments.

A general theme in your rankings is having pitchers ranked way above where they should be. First, Santana cannot be ranked this high. He is my favorite player, but putting him as the second most valuable fantasy commodity is a stretch. We know we are getting a Cy Young season every year out of him, but there aren't too many young stud hitters while solid SP can be found throughout the draft.

Liriano is ranked WAY too high. Keep in mind he has faced only mediocre offenses to this point, and is also in his first pass around the league, although I am not sure whether that is significant.

Also, closers shouldn't be making this list but that is debatable. Jenks definitely should not be on it though.

The hitting rankings look generally good. I would move Hafner and Ichiro lower. Vlad and DLee should be higher. As a general list though, it looks pretty good.

Thanks for taking the time to compose a set of rankings.
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Postby The_Met_Threat » Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:00 am

These rankings are ok, a few things i have problems with though.

#1 - Santana at 2. Just too high for a pitcher.

#2 - Crawford at 3? Why?

#3 - Franscico is too high. He's almost logged half a season in terms of career ip.

#4 - Alfonso at 15. He was around 15 before the season, with it being more than likely hell get traded, and proving he can hit in Washington, he should be a first round lock.

#5 - Vladdy is a little too low. Can't just write him off to a mid-late 2nd from the #3 overall pick that easily.

#6 - Zambrano is definately not the 3rd pitcher i'd take off the board.

#7 - Carlos Lee not getting enough love, should be in the 2nd round if he keeps up into the 2nd half.

#8 - Realize that B.J Ryan is better than Papelbon, and a much safer pick.

#9 - You could probably find someone better than C Pat at 50.

Everything else is pretty good.
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Postby Scout » Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:41 am

The_Met_Threat wrote:#6 - Zambrano is definately not the 3rd pitcher i'd take off the board.


Really? When you take into account stats, age, health, and expectation, I think Zambrano is right there at the top of the list. I would take him as the second pitcher off the board in a keeper.

Almost every other great pitcher is old, oft injured, or has only pitched dominantly for a limited time.

Which pitchers do you take above Zambrano?
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Postby Belle4Hall88 » Mon Jul 03, 2006 2:18 am

The_Met_Threat wrote:These rankings are ok, a few things i have problems with though.

#1 - Santana at 2. Just too high for a pitcher.

#2 - Crawford at 3? Why?

#3 - Franscico is too high. He's almost logged half a season in terms of career ip.

#4 - Alfonso at 15. He was around 15 before the season, with it being more than likely hell get traded, and proving he can hit in Washington, he should be a first round lock.

#5 - Vladdy is a little too low. Can't just write him off to a mid-late 2nd from the #3 overall pick that easily.

#6 - Zambrano is definately not the 3rd pitcher i'd take off the board.

#7 - Carlos Lee not getting enough love, should be in the 2nd round if he keeps up into the 2nd half.

#8 - Realize that B.J Ryan is better than Papelbon, and a much safer pick.

#9 - You could probably find someone better than C Pat at 50.

Everything else is pretty good.


1. Well those are just my own personal rankings, and I think that Johan is that good, and the only guy I would take before him is Pujols.

2. Crawford at #3, because this is a keeper league list, and the guy is just phenominal. He's gonna give you .300+ AVG, 100+ runs, 20+ HR, 90+ RBI, and 50+ SB and he is not even in his prime yet. I think were a couple years away from him being the #1 pick overall.

3. Liriano is that high because it is a keeper league and personaly i think he is that good, maybe the next Johan.

4. With Soriano, yes he is amazing, but I would still take those 14 guys ahead of him, he is doing basically about what i thought he would do this year.

5. I think Vladdy is slowly on the decline and i would take guys like Sizemore, Bay, Wells ahead of him at this point in a kepper league.

6. Zambrano is just awesome, he'll give you well over 200 K's with a great ERA and decent whip and wins. He will only improve and he may be a future CY Young.

7. Lee is great but you gotta look at what other guys are doing I still think Holliday and Mauer ect. would be a little higher on my draft board.

8. You're probably right about BJ Ryan. No arguments there.

9. I actually think Patterson is foreal, he should be good for 40+ SB with around 20 HRs and a decent avg for the next couple years imo.
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Postby ukrneal » Mon Jul 03, 2006 2:54 am

Interesting topic, but don't forget this is a list in motion. Remember how VMart lit it up in the second half last year? I'm sure there will be some more of that, as well as some guys who just consistently improve from a slow start (as well as some guys who continue to diasppear after a super start). So while it is useful to start thinking about this now, there is still a lot of baseball to come. When I see inexperienced pitchers ranked high, I get nervous, because they have a tendency to have uneven patches (or worse). And for an RP, all it takes is 2-3 games and his numbers suddenly don't look so great.

And with hitters, I want to see how they do after August. A lot of them tire in August and with the new drug policy, we may see that more pronounced this year.
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Postby The_Met_Threat » Mon Jul 03, 2006 11:55 am

My bad, forgot it was keeper rankings all together, but most of my points still stand whether its re draft or keeper.
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Any updated keeper rankings for 2007?

Postby LilRascal23 » Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:36 am

Scout, your keeper tiers for last year were excellent. Would you or anyone else on the board mind posting revisions for this year? Thanks.
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